As the maturely named thread title states, I'm not a huge fan of the Kingdom Hearts series. In the recent E3, my wife came bounding into my room when Kingdom Hearst 3 was announced during the Sony conference and stated her excitement for the next installment. Over the years, she's wanted me to play KH1 and 2 with her so that she could prove it isn't as bad as I think it is. I've been reluctant over these years because I, myself, have tried to played through it on two different occasions and have given up both times.

But now since a third is finally in the works, she wants to play through them again, and I have finally agreed to play through them with her. So I thought it would be an interesting thread if I documented my experience through the two games via a Gold Glee - Chrono Trigger kind of thread. I won't be using spoilers nor am I concerned about being spoiled on plot points later in the games. So, here we go...

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The game opens with a music video by Utada Hikaru. I think it's a little weird that you are treated to a music video after starting a new game as that's usually the kind of thing you get from sitting on the main menu for long enough, but I'm a Utada fan, so I'm not going to complain. By the time you are able to start the game, you are in what appears as the main character's dreams. These will double as the game's tutorial. The games combat seems basic enough, and I can tell that it's going to be mostly button mashy... which as a hack-and-slash fan, I find a little disappointing. But this is the beginning of the game so hopefully it'll get a bit more complicated through the game. During the dream/tutorial, you are met by Selphie (FF8), Titus, and Waka (FF10). Seeing as it's a dream, I don't really question it. They ask you some generic questions that may possibly dictate character development.

After running through the tutorial, Sora is woken up by his friend, Kairi. Sora insists that his dreams are, in fact, real... and then you are treated to the first mission of the game. A FETCH QUEST! I love those! ¬_¬ So we need to find several pieces of a raft before we can proceed. While gathering the pieces, we run across the Final Fantasy characters previously mentioned. It is here that I'm not kind of thrown into a sea of questions. Why are they here? Why are they children? How did they get here? Why are they acting like it's okay they were sucked out from their own worlds? ARE there different worlds? I mean, I'm sure they all get answered eventually, or you can go ahead and answer that for me, I don't really care. But you have the option to fight all three of them individually. Fighting Waka, we were awarded with... nothing. Okay, maybe we have to beat all three of them. After beating Selphie and receiving nothing again, I was sure of it. But after finally taking out Tidus.... we got a big whopping, NOTHING. Thanks. So after finally getting all the parts and taking them back, we learn why we are collecting raft pieces. Apparently Sora, Kairi, and the third protagonist(?), Riku plan on sailing off the secluded island to specifically look for other worlds. I guess their dinky little raft is going to sprout rocket thrusters and take them out into space or something... because I hardly even seems it sea-worthy.

Anyway, Sora goes to sleep for the night and it shifts to a world where apparently Mickey Mouse is a king. But his throne was empty, as we see Donald Duck discovering that he had left. Pluto had a letter from Mickey, I can only assume, and took it to Goofy. The scene ends with Minney and Daisy silently demanding to know the contents of said letter.

The next day, after getting the parts, comes fetch quest part 2. Three mushrooms now. Yay. While finding them we run into some kind of cloaked figure that spouts all this existential BS about how Sora won't be able to do the things he is pre-destin to do. You know, despite the fact that is was pre-destined.

We then find out back in Disney world that Mickey has left because the stars have slowly been going out and this spells doom for Disney world. So he asked Goofy and Donald (of all people) to search out Sora and help him for reasons he couldn't explain other than he is the "key." So Goofy and Donald take off in what will be known later as a gummy ship. I remember this much of the game and that sickly mini-game you have to play any time you want to travel somewhere else. But more on that later.

Sora wakes up at night only to be attacked by the same enemies in his tutorial/dream. He runs into Riku who mentions shortly how they can finally leave through some portal above and then sinks into the ground via some shadowy thing. And then Sora was given the infamous keyblade... for no real reason. It just kind of appeared. He finds Kairi who disappears as she passes through Sora like a ghost. At this point, I have more questions than I know how to put into words. Anyways, que giant boss fight that was originally in the tutorial/dream. After it's defeat, Sora is sucked into the portal previously mentioned in the air.

Shift back to Donald and Goofy who witness a random star going out... and apparently that is what threatens Mickey's world. Apparently they are in a new town looking for a guy name Leon. Just around the corner is an unconscious Sora. Why he is now here, I have no idea. But now you are able to freely check out the first town, Traverse Town. I will say, out of anything, at least the music in the game is really good. We run into a random shop and find Cid (FF7). It's here that I have a question that bugs me too much to let go. To my understanding, all these FF characters are being scattered from their home world by... something. Fine. I get it. But why is Cid his normal age and Selphie, Waka, and Titus children?! Does whatever happen revert some of them to children and then some of them not? I just really don't get it.
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Anyways, this was the point in which we stopped. My initial feelings are that of serious confusion and frustration. Not really a good first impression. More to come this weekend.

Well, even if she has different tastes, at least your wife is passionate about video games.

You're not that far into the game. Of course you're not going to have a lot of answers for everything. Just give it more time. It's not my favorite game series, but it's not super terrible. I'm not exactly sure what you expect from the game.

I really shouldn't set the bar too high for a game that tries to cram all the FF character with all the Disney character and somehow make a working story out of it...

I just think you're kind of over critical of something you've barely played and haven't even gotten close to finishing. You finished Parasite Eve 3, so I don't know why you can't give this a chance.

That's exactly what I'm doing right now and what this thread is for. And yes, I have standards. And no, I don't make exceptions. I'm in it for the long haul this time. For better or for worse.

...mostly worse.

So after talking with Syn, SK, and Kajak, they told me that I was being a bit too harsh on the game. So I'm going to try and pull back on the throttle a little bit and try to put myself in a position where I can possibly enjoy the game. The reason I've been the way I have was because both times I quit have just imprinted on me that I will not and can not enjoy this game. But for the sake of this topic being credible at all, I'll do my best to restrain my disdain. Anyways, I'm actually writing this AS we play. So these are my initial thoughts as I play through the game.
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After wandering around long enough through Transverse town, we run into a scene of a man having his heart removied. Apparently these are required for the enimes of the game to exist. After the fight the guy that was laying there just vanished. Like, the guy didn't get his heart back so I guess... he died? Anyways, it's here I am reminded money in this game is called "munny." And I'm fine with a lot of names for money in the game like Gald, Zenny, Ponch, good old fashion gold... but the lolcat spelling of money for money? I find that really weird. But It's a minor gripe so I'm not going to worry about it.

So apparently we're trying to run into Donald and Goofy, and it's kind of a Scooby Doo chase scene with you going in some doors and Donald and Goofy coming out of others. I don't know if this is random or if there is actually a set order of doors you need to go into to meet them. Eventually we run into "Leon" who turns out to be Squall from FF8, who you get to fight. But now I seriously want to throw into question the age thing. Selphie and Squall are from the same world. Why did Selphie revert in age to a child and Squall doesn't? Spoilers or no, I really would like to know. We then are introduced to Yuffie and later Aeris (FF7). Though, I always assumed that Aeris kind of... died. Giant sword? Sepheroth? So is this before any of this happens in the respected games? Genuine curiosity. I Promise. Anyways, we learn from Yuffie, Squall, and Aeris that common people are turned into heartless. Also, Sora is the chosen one.

It's here we finally meet up with Goofy and Donanld who assist you in a boss fight. Afterwards you decide to travel with the two and, in a separate scene, are introduced to a bunch of Disney villans who've gotten together to do something. It's not explained. I will say though I'm really impressed with the voice acting. They either got all the original voice actors or they got people who are REALLY good at the voices.

And now comes one of the main reasons I ended up quitting originally. There is this terrible Star Fox rip-off you have to play any time you go to a world. The controls are stiff and it is genuinely awful and I have absolutely no idea who thought this would be a good idea. It's not fun, and it takes way too long to get from one planet to another. It breaks the flow of the game and is nothing short of a chore. I MAYBE would understand if you had to fly to a NEW world, but only the first time. But every time you want to travel? That's complete BS. After coming out of the gummi ship mini-game, we made it to Alice in Wonderland world. A few minutes in and I can see they paid a lot of attention to the source material. From the charcters to the mechanics of growing small and large. And even Alice, herself. And I actually appreciate the detail spent on at least this world. Anyways, Alice is being charged by the Queen for trying to steal her heart and we are tasked with proving her innocense. Unfotunately from here it turns into another fetch quest as we are required to find four pieces of evidence that are scattered throughout the world in little pink boxes. A lot of these require platforming to get to and it's here I realized just how floaty Sora's jumping really is. I missed quite a few jumps that I felt I really should have made.

Eventually we collect everything and the queen tells us we can only show her one of them... which kind of pisses me off a little bit we had to search for all of them only to find out they weren't even going to be used. Though I can't say that it's out of character for the queen. Anyways, Alice is hauled up in a bird cage in the air and you have to fight off the card guards while finding a way to lower her. So after a while we finally managed to get her down. Only to find out somehow she was kidnapped while suspended in the air locked in a bird cage. I'd love to hear how THAT was possible. I have a feeling that's going to get glossed over though...

So after messing around for a good while in Wonderland, we finally made it to the next boss fight. It's here I've picked up on a few things. You aren't told how effective magic spells are. We have fire and blizzard, but there is no damage indicator, so we have no idea if the spells are effective... or if they even do damage. And MP is so sparse that it really doesn't matter. A few casts and you're drained of everything. Then it's back to the basic three hit combo. I really wish there was an enemy health bar or numeric damage indicators or something. Again, this is fairly early in, so I expect it to get a little bit more in depth by the end of the game. Another thing that I've noticed is that level ups only award you a single stat increase per level. I'm sure the game's perfectly balanced and all, but it's jut not very rewarding when you get a level up and the only thing that goes up is defense. It's kind of like in Earthbound when Paula levels up and only get like 1 HP and 1 MP... and that's the whole level. I also don't really like how limited the number of items you can take with you into battle... or how quickly Goofy and Donald are to use them willy-nilly. I looked around for AI options, but there aren't any. The reason I found out about this was because we were actually having trouble with the boss in question. We wanted to stock up on items, so that's TWO more trips through the gummi ship mini game to return to Transverse town and back. After the boss fight we are told that Alice is simply not here. We then unlock the talking door from the movie and... that's it. So I guess that means we leave. The game doesn't have really good conveyance.

So to go to the next world, we have to do the gummi ship mini game to get back to Transverse town and then another time to get to a new world... assuming everything we could do in Wonderland is done. The game really doesn't say, so who knows. As it turns out, you can just hold the shoot button and completely ignore the mini game and you'll survive... which is nice, but begs the question of what the point of it even being there to begin with. So after the two flights to the new world, we end up in Hercules' world. We meet Philoctetes and he talks about a kind of battle arena where you supposedly fight a bunch of monsters. But not before a barrel smashing mini game. Which is a TON more fun than the gummi ship, even if it is just simply walking up to them and hitting them. Upon leaving Hades gives us a pass into the arena. They nailed his character so well. I love that guy. Anyways, now we are allowed to fight. After the first round, Cloud Strife (FF7) walks silently and intimidatingly (at least I think that's what they were going for) by. Then it's a few more rounds of heartless. Then we are treated to a scene with Hades talking to Cloud about how he managed to talk him into trying to kill Herc and was trying to get him to kill Sora at while he was here. I do have to admit I loved it when Hades said, "suckers like him (Cloud) are hard to come by." Hades is awesome. Anyways, Cloud one-shots Goofy and Donald and then easily takes out Sora. Cloud doesn't finish him though, so Hades summons cerberus on you... which Herc stops. After saving and sorting out items, we head back into the arena to fight cerberus. Herc runs off with Cloud and Philoctetes encourages us to attack. After several failed attempts, we find out this fight isn't even required. It's optional. So I guess the entire stop here in Herc world was completely optional? Hell if I know. The game doesn't have really good conveyance. So I guess that means we're heading to the third world. Back to the gummi ship! ¬_¬

We end up in Tarzan world. Sora was separated from Goofy and Donald because apparently Sora and Donald had an argument about landing on this planet or not. Sora meets up with Tarzan as they go off to look for Riku and Kairi. You get to do that thing from the Tarzan movie where you slide through trees and stuff, but it is very short lived. You meet up with Jane, and Clayton bring in Donald and Goofy. So the whole teams together again. At least we have the option to trade out a character with Tarzan... so we changed him in for Donald, who's proven to be adapt in the art of dying quickly. So into the forest we go. And it takes us quite some time before we even know what it is we are doing here. I know looking for Riku and Kairi is on the "do to" list here, but I really don't think we'll be seeing them again till the end of the game. So what we are ACTUALLY supposed to be doing is vague at best. The game doesn't have really good conveyance. So it's here we saved and stopped for the day.

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Anyways, I think we've past the farthest point before I quit. Having reached this point, my original opinion of the game hasn't really changed. I still can not stand the gummi ship mini game and the unanswered questions just keep piling on. But at least from this point on, it'll be further into the game than I've ever been, so at least I can look forward to that, right?

The Gummi ship becomes more manageable soon (You will be able to teleport to worlds you have been to before). And I completely agree with the bad conveyance thing, especially in Tarzan's world. When I played it recently, I probably spent the most time there out of the rest of the Disney worlds, just because the game never really told what I had to do.

As for the voice acting, yeah the game has some great (edit: good) voice acting, just because they got a lot of the original Disney voice actors to play their characters. The only voice I really can't stand is Leon/Squall's, because he sounds like he has a speech impediment.

Also, I'll point out that you have met all but one Final Fantasy character in the game that I can recall off the top of my head.

... Wait. No damage indicator? Like, in any fight?

Um, why?



Yeah, I said maybe you were being bias, but, that certainly doesn't change the fact that this game does appear to suck

You eventually get a skill that lets you view the enemy's HP bar.

You eventually learn the Scan ability, which places a health bar over the enemies.

A way to teleport form planet to planet would be a godsend. And at least I have a walkthrough if the conveyance continues to be... minimal at best. Definitely makes it harder to enjoy. But thanks for the heads up about Scan. That really should have been there from the get-go. But the fact that it's on the way puts me at ease little bit.

Will it work against bosses?

Also, if I had to guess, the inclusion of Final Fantasy characters will never be explained. They're probably just alternate versions of their original counterparts, native to the worlds of Kingdom Hearts. Also, Squall is named Leon right from the start? In KH2 they explain that he changed his name to hide some unfortunate past, and I figured that unfortunate past was from KH1.

Scan does work against bosses.

The inclusion of Final Fantasy characters is actually explained in the first game, by Squall and the other characters in Traverse Town. All of the Square-Enix characters used to live in a world called Hollow Bastion, which has been destroyed, which is why they are scattered across the different Disney worlds now. You will eventually go to Hollow Bastion later on.

In the second game, Hollow Bastion has been pretty much completely restored, and is pretty much the only world in which you will find Final Fantasy characters.

I'm looking forward to them explaining just how they were able to freely travel from their own world and to the Hollow Bastion... as well as why certain characters revert in age and others don't.

I don't really see why the character's ages are such a big deal; You are playing a game where not only do you have characters from multiple Final Fantasy game showing up together, but they are showing up alongside Disney characters.

The game doesn't have to be consistent with the Final Fantasy games. In fact, both Cloud and Sephiroth show up in both games, and make references to how they have fought each other before. It's not like this game takes place DURING the events of the other Final Fantasy games.

EDIT: I guess my advice is that you need to lighten up a little bit. don't take the game too serious.

I guess what gets me is the blatant disregard for the past of the characters they use. Like, if Cloud and Sephiroth fought before, then that obviously takes place after Aeris' death. And yeah, it does bug me a little bit that supposedly Squall and Selphie traveled to Hollow Bastion, and for some unexplained reason, Selphie dropped about a decade of age.

It's not so much a big deal as it is I just really really want to know...

Thanks for all the replies thus far. They are really helping. Between the last time we played and now, we grinded around for a bit and got Scan so we can actually see the damage we are doing. We're also looking forward to the teleport ability for the gummi ship. Levels are very slow going, but apparently that's because when we were asked what time the journey began in the beginning tutorial survey, we picked dawn... which means that we will gain levels slowly until level 40, and then they'd pick up. I would have REALLY like to have known that's what we were picking. But why should the player ever be given that kind of information, right?
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So, as it turns out, we were stuck in Tarzan world not knowing what to do because instead of being TOLD we need to complete a fetch quest, we were IN a fetch quest and just not told what or why we were collecting. It turned out to be slides for a projector. You know, at first, I thought the fetch quests at the beginning were just going to be there and only there. But they seem to be getting worse. I really don't like this. Anyways, the slides convince Tarzan that Riku and Kairi are with the gorillas. So Tarzan will take us there. Or more, we have to wander around until we find it because he actually doesn't show us where jack is. He just follows us as a party member. ¬_¬ We spent the next 45 minutes running around the jungle running into random scenes and eventually ended up in the same room we've been in with these flower buds. Apparently you were SUPPOSED to cast blizzard on all the buds. We've done this before and it's done nothing, but THIS time it actually does something. How we were supposed to know, I have no clue. Sing it with me, guys: The game doesn't have really good conveyance. Eventually we are thrown into a fight with evil Clayton. More evil than usual Clayton. Eventually he mounts an invisible... something. Not really sure what invisibility is going to do for you when you have a VERY visible person riding you, but whatever. At least the Scan HP bar actually showing the damage we are doing makes things SO much more bearable. Though we keep forgetting the AI using items up immediately, so they never have any during times when they are important, like this boss fight for example. Okay, so here's the deal. The chameleon Clayton rides eventually fights on it's own. So it's the chameleon and Clayton separately. We spend the time to focus on the chameleon who has 2 and a half full HP bars to deal with. After working that HP down to nothing, the boss refuses to die. His HP stuck on 1. Apparently it doesn't matter, because you CAN'T kill the chameleon. To end the fight you have to beat Clayton. Why the chameleon even had an HP bar is beyond me. In fact, it really pisses me off that we spent the time to get his HP down and it turns out he's literally invincible. Thanks game. Anyways, we beat More Evil Than Normal Clayton and learn the cure spell. Which I'm fairly sure is the ONLY spell we'll be using from now on.

It's here that the leader of the gorillas,Kerchak, throws Sora and company Team-Rocket-blasting-off-again style onto a cliff which leads to Tarzan's home. It's here we find a keyhole and Sora and Donald make up and they unlock... nothing... with the keyblade. Anyways it cuts to another scene with all the bad guys. And it's here we are told they are collecting princesses... and then Alice is brought out. You know, despite the fact that ALICE ISN'T A PRINCESS AT ALL. At least we know who took her. Not really sure how though. They also talk like they have more than just Alice, but I don't remember them getting any more. It's here we are rewarded with a new keyblade. I was under the assumption just the one chose Sora as a master, so did this one also pick Sora? Also, where did it come from? We just got a message saying "you got a new one!" without actually seeing where it came from or how we got it. It's weird. Anyways, we are also rewarded with TWO trips through the gummi ship mini game on our way back to Transverse town. Anyways, we are on our way back to look for Squall. And we eventually find him along with zombie Aeris (and yes, that's what I'm calling her now since she's supposed to be dead). So they tell us a little bit about the key holes and some dude name Ansem and tell us to talk to Cid. Hearing him talk about gummi ships and gummi blocks with a straight face is really funny. But he says he'll help upgrade our gummi ship if we take this old book to Merlin from Sword in the Stone and the godmother from Cinderella. She also gives us Simba as a... summons, I think?

On our way back to Cid, we run into Riku of all people... who's apparently doing just fine. He eventually takes off... and I have to say he totally looks like the good guy that eventually turns bad guy. Anyways, we get back to Cid's only to find that he's not even there. He went to the third district or something. Lots of running around. Eventually we find Cid, Squall, and zombie Aeris. And he installs the freaking warp item so we can skip the gummi ship HOLY CRAP I AM SO FREAKING HAPPY RIGHT NOW! The only time we have to play that horrible mini game is when we go to a new world. Anyways, we then see Maleficent who seems to be head of the Disney bad guys talking with Riku about how Sora has betrayed him yadda yadda. So I think I was right about the whole good guy turned bad guy thing. So yeah, now we need to go to the second district to ring a bell three times... because we were told to and no other reason. Turns out it hides the keyhole in this world. So a boss fight and a new aero spell later, and we've unlocked another keyhole. From here we WARPED (holy crap, yes) back to Herc's world and beat cerberus. And I think it was option, because nothing really happened other than Cloud moping around and Hades getting angry that Cloud lost. So we head to the new warphole on the world map.

To get to the new set of Disney worlds, we are have to go through an extra long gummi ship mini game. But I confide in the fact that these are limited to only a few more. After a while, we make it to Agrabah. Jafar and Gilbert Gottfried are talking with Maleficent about finding the keyhole before we do as well as trying to find Princess jasmine. Eventually, we run across Aladin and Genie to help us find and rescue Jasmine. Couldn't get Robin Williams to do Genie's voice it seems. So it's been about a straight half hour of running around Agrabah and we have no idea where we need to go. I would mention the conveyance, but there's really no point anymore. Maybe a map of explored areas or a waypoint would make this less of a chore. It's also here that I found a LOT of frustration from the platforming. I ended up just walking off of half of the jumps I tried to make. Actually so did the wife. So I really do think it's just bad platforming. After a long while we eventually found Jasmine being attacked by Jafar. And before anything else happens, Gilbert Gottfried steals Genie's lamp and Jafar runs off with it. Aladin's kind of an idiot. They retreat to the desert and it's here we fight the entrance to the cave of wonders. It's a nice set piece if nothing else. We made it a ways into the cave of wonders and quit at the next save point.
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Having made progress father than I've ever been before, I haven't really seen a lot that would have changed my opinion when I quit. Combat hasn't really gotten any more deep. I mean, we can hit four times instead of three, but that's a very minor upgrade. The cure spell helps but it pretty much means I'm not going to use any other spell now. I do find myself looking forward to exploring new Disney worlds, but the grind to get from plot point to plot point has been a bit tiring. But at least there hasn't been any more fetch quests since Tarzan. If you guys have any more tips, explanations, or suggestions, please let me know.

Nothing really to say other than total agreement about conveyance.

I think the only way I managed to get through the game the last time without ever really feeling lost (except in the Tarzan world) was that in the back of mind, I still had some sort of inkling about what i was supposed to do next at each point.

Also, I'd like to point out one huge flaw with KH1 that I only noticed the last time I played. Almost every world is the same as the last, just with a new soundtrack and texture pack applied to it. Each world seems to have the same platforming, the same enemies, and the same everything else.

Wait, Riku isn't Riku?

Also, Lantis, let us know if it ever gets to the point where the plot of a Disney world completely rips off the Disney movie it's based on. That's my biggest gripe about KH2.